Rough Collie Forum:
Full Registration...

Hi, I was wondering how full registration works. I know when you give full reg. out the owner can breed the dog but could you put a dog on limited reg. and then when the dog ch/points let he/she go on to full reg? I have heard that some people did this and I wasn't sure if they were correct. If you have any info let me know. Kate:o) PS My new pup is due pretty soon!

I'm not 100% sure on this... but I believe if a dog is on limited registration he/she is not able to compete in conformation shows.... but can do obedience, agility etc....

Thats sort of what I thought. Although I have no litters planned but I thought for future litters I could put a show pup on limited eg until it ch/pointed and then give out full reg for the pup. I heard somebody say you could do this but I really didn't think you could so I figured I would ask you guys. Kate:o)

The difference between Full and Limited is that only Full registration allows you to show in conformation and register pups you would breed from that dog. Essentially Limited Reg. only allows you to show the dog in the performance events. You can as the breeder, place a pup on Limited and allow it to grow up and evaluate it later and decide if it should be switched back to Full registration, but only you as the breeder can change the Limited to Full. Actually, I find Limited registration pretty useless. It might deter some people from breeding because they can't register with the AKC (although many will register the pups with the ConKC or the UKC anyways), but I have found that for many people it doesn't matter if they can register the pups or not, they will still advertise them as "full-blooded no papers" in the Classifieds and sell them at $200-$250 as "just pets", which is not exactly doing what the limited reg is intended to do for you, which is get that new pet owner to spay or netuer that puppy they get from you. You can ALWAYS co-own a dog with a written contract until the new owner completes your requirements to get 100% of the registration of the dog. I recommend this as a good way to make sure the new owner is showing the dog and finishing health tests to help them learn to be a responsible breeder. You just make it part of your contract on a full registration that BOTH of your signatures are required to register ANY pups they dog produces until the requirements of the co-ownership are met. That limits people who just want to breed "registered" dogs and not put any of the work into proving they have the quality that should be bred. Hope that answers your questions some.

Yes, that does help! It answers my question. You see what I want to do when I sell show pups be able to make the owner not be able to breed them until the dog shows its quality. For pets I want to put spay/neuter and l. reg on them. I was also wondering if I could sell a pet pup w/ l.reg and a spay/neuter contract and then after they are spay/neutered can I then send the AKC papers after seeing proof of spay/neutering? Thanks a lot LegondHold! Kate:o)

Actually for your pet contract you can mark the limited and write into your contract that you will only send the completed paperwork after you have proof of spay or neuter. Generally you'd have the new owner fill out everything but you just keep the registration slip and only after you see the receipt from the Vet do you send in the paper work which the AKC will just mail the completed copy back tot he new owner. I'd offer to pay the registration fee for having the new owner wait that long to get the papers which smooths things over a bit with a pet owner. Or you can do like I do and just spay or neuter you pet quality pups at 11 weeks old and be done with it. I have done this on two different litters now over the past 5 years and it has work wonderfully. No problems. It just makes things easier.

I'm just wondering but is it hard to find a vet that will spay/neuter at 11 or 12 weeks of age?

The vet I work for (85% of the time I Just do kennels...LOL the other 15% I sometimes help in exam rooms, oh and I do run the heart worm tests, feline luek, and FIV tests now LOL) anyway the vet I work for won't spay or neuter dogs or cats before 6 months of age. Although a couple weeks ago I was talking to the lady that use to watch my dogs for me out at her place when we went on trips.... the vet she now works for does spay/neuters at 12 weeks.... but I have no idea where she works, I think up in Lancaster now.

Oh well, just curious.

Yes and No. I've been able to find them and I do all my s/n at 11 weeks now. Collies are typically 15-20 lbs by then and a good weight to take the stress. May other breeds like papillions, poms, toy poodles and the like are much smaller at 6 month old and are still spayed and neutered. There has been a lot of reasarch and the effects of early spay/neuter and they all report the same basically benign effects. I would hope a Vet is up to date on that reasearch and has kept up with some reading in his/her profession. If not, I think I'd find another Vet. Most Vets who deal with breeders that bring in a lot of clients or dogs and pay a lot of moeny to their practices are more willing to consider the breeders request then someone that isn't as experienced in dogs in general. Again, you have to find a Vet that has the equipment to monitor a puppy as they don't react to anethetic the same as adults. They acutally wake up faster and the balance between being under and being dead is a bit more tricky on a pup. Most good Vets can handle it though and I always recommend AAHA Vets because they are typically more up to date then general practice Vets that are not AAHA members.

Oh ok...

I guess when I asked that question I should have said I don't believe my vet will do early spay/neutering. I can't say for sure, as I don't work down there in the mornings, which is when they do the surgeries, and I haven't had to have a pup spayed or neutered for about 4 yrs. Which was Macey, my sable merle girl I use to have. Magic was 5 1/2 months when I got her... and Timmy was neutered at 1 yr of age.

Hmmmm..... I ought to ask the vet about that, just to see what her opinion is, and what she does....

Oh ok...Well there is a bunch of information out there about early s/n. It has been going on at shelters across the country for nearly 20 years now. It's not exactly a new idea. It's a little more tricky for a Vet to do, but not especially so. You can always ask and see what the Vet's say, but I can find you information on it if you'd like.

No... thats ok. I was just curious to know about if it was easy to find a vet to do it or not. No real reason, just wondering. We have 3- single vet practices here in town, so I would guess one if not more would do it, if they were asked to....